In this interview, we delve into the creative world of Idio Chichava, a Mozambican choreographer, exploring his vision of the whole body, of song and dance, of the transmission of gestural culture, of peoples, migration and contemporary dance. These concepts come together in his production *Vagabundus*, which will be performed at the Mercat de les Flors from 1st to 3rd.

– This proposal, presented at Mercat de les flors these days, goes through the transformation of bodies through gestural culture, bodily constructions, transmission and experience from the backbone of the work. How is this reflected into your artistic practice at Vagabundus and in relation to the performers’ life experiences?

When I talk about this, for me, it’s really connected with the thing that I always defend is the knowledge of the African or Mozambican dancers. I mean, that the dancers that have been constructed or formed or transmitted a traditional dance, which is for me, an aesthetic form, which is for me, another way to move through the space and to understand the movements. So when I say that, I really look for what the bodies give to the space and how the bodies are really able to share with the other bodies in the space. So that way we can really go to this understanding of a collective or community. That’s why I’m really  focused on the bodies.

So in the first line, I was looking for different kinds of bodies, not only bodies that we understand that this is a dance body or not. I was more looking for different kinds, of the different plasticities of bodies within the space of Vagabundus.

– In your artistic practice, you speak of the body in its entirety, as it includes singing and dance. What does this ‘total body’ mean to you, and how does it relate to the traditions of Mozambique?

When I say full body, I say the global body, which is not only related with the traditional dance of Mozambique, but it’s related with my research in traditional dance of Mozambique. I don’t know if that’s easy to understand. It means that the Mozambican bodies, when they’re dancing, they are not only moving, they are also making voice.

They are also singing. So for me, in my research, which was related to presence, I was really focused on presence. What, how is to be very efficace in the projection of your intentions while you are performing, while you are dancing, while you are making a transmission of dancing.

So I found that in traditional dance, we have this singing and it is this kind of repetition that takes us into a kind of evocative state, the state of evocation. So when I say dance or movement and voice, dance and singing, for me, this is a full body, full body in terms of presence. That’s the thing. I’m also looking for a full presence on stage, a presence that’s really sharp and clearly transmits what we want to share with the audience.

– One of the key aspects of the piece is the collective element, right from the start of the process – from the artistic practice at its core to the culture of your country. You also mention that the materials from Vagabundus are available to everyone, so that everyone can enjoy them. Could you tell us a bit more about this process and your experiences with the collective?

There is a principle that I really do apply in my own practice or practices. So when I say ‘breathing together’, I mean that we are all able to breathe and we all have a body. So if we breathe together, we just have to make a rhythm, rhythmical breathing. And if we are able to make a rhythm, rhythmical breathing, it means that we are able to dance and share the moment together. It means that it also opens a place to look at each other and to look at the space.

That’s why I say I’m not really focussing on the technique of the dancers or the bodies that are in front of me. I’m really focused on how you breathe and how you invite people to breathe with you. The big part of my training is that you breathe louder so we can hear you.

So you’re inviting people to breathe with you; that’s why I say that anyone can do our dance, because it’s all about breathing and being together. I’d also like to add something important, if you’re part of a group, and we’re breathing and you invite someone else to breathe with you, then you’re also building the collective system, the collective system for being together on stage.

– Regarding the group of dancers in the piece, you mentioned that the piece is in flux, the group is constantly changing, and in this way new elements and learnings are incorporated. For example, the incorporation of the Mapiko dance, which also brings a new narrative. 

When I got started with this, I was also part of that movement towards open spaces where you could meet people, socialise with others and get to know other dancers. That’s why I used to say that ‘Vagabundus’ isn’t just a dance piece; it’s also a project that brings people together in the same space. That’s why, even today, when I was in the studio working on this piece, there were about 10 or 20 of us dancing ‘Vagabundus’.

The thing is, I wanted everyone to experience this – the questions that were coming up for me, all the questions that are circulating or running through our country right now. So the material we’re sharing is also about emotions and feelings. There’s a journey we’re on to express the feelings we’re experiencing at this moment.

So when I said that Mapiko was what I wanted to include, it’s because in northern Mozambique we have this kind of terrorism. And we ask ourselves: how can we ensure that this part of the country is present in our bodies, in our consciousness and also in the debates? For example, what is Makonde? Mapiko is the traditional dance from Makonde people, that comes from northern Mozambique.

That’s why I’m very open to this, we must always be aware of what’s happening around us. So that we can enrich our dance and our presence. On stage, there are many interconnected levels. And it’s also a bit of a controversial topic.

For me, that’s it. It’s about how we can use material that can speak to all the dancers, to all the people who are living the experience of being Vagabundus right now. That’s what it’s all about.

– An eternal issue in contemporary art, and one that remains unresolved, is the distance between what is considered traditional and what is considered contemporary. The combination that emerges in your work is both interesting and revealing, where the traditional dances of Mozambique—which provide the anchor and structure—engage in dialogue with contemporary dance, which serves to introduce questions and twists. How do you feel about these dualities or synergies? And on those traditional dances that are now part of the vocabulary of contemporary dance.

This is quite interesting. For me, traditions are really connected to our roots, to our origins, where we come from.  It’s about passing on the same story and preserving it over the years. And that’s how it’s kept alive. For me, it’s something very, very beautiful to have. But when I look at dance, traditional dance, I see a lot of material, which is something I actually use, and I talk to the dancers.

We don’t have to see traditional dance as a prison, but as a place where we can find a rich source of expression, a place from which we can draw on many things to express ourselves. And the force that traditional dance gives us is something you already have; you already possess an identity. So you don’t have to look for identity, it’s already there. What you have to do is figure out how to give it form, and that’s where contemporary dance comes into my work. The thing is, contemporary dance provides me with a lot of material to rethink traditional dance and a lot of material to it.

That is where, for me, contemporary and traditional dance complement each other perfectly.

My view of traditional dance today is that it constitutes a very rich school and that, through Vagabundus, I prefer to preserve it and spread it throughout the world. We also have a group of dancers, a group of bodies that allows us to integrate it into contemporary dance, where the language is universal. That’s how I see these two forms as complementary, and I also see traditional dance as a great school, and I believe that everyone on the planet should regard traditional dance, whether from Mozambique or anywhere else, as an important vocabulary for learning dance worldwide. Whether it’s contemporary dance, but everyone, whether in the West or in the East, everyone should learn the traditional dance of Mozambique and also embrace the traditional or folk dance of their own countries.

– Traditional Mozambican dances involve foot percussion, stamping the ground quite forcefully and, indeed, conveying that the energy does not remain on the surface. ‘If there are layers, you have to go and find them’. Could you tell us a bit more about these practices and the energy they generate in terms of how the stage space is perceived?

There is something in traditional dance in Mozambique is that we never dance alone, even if you see one body, we never dance alone. And later, when I met David Zambrano and other choreographers such as Thomas Hauert, they said that you always have to dance between different points on the stage.

That made it clearer to me what the direction of traditional dance is and what that source of energy in traditional dance was. So when I say that when we touch the floor in traditional dance, it is not just to follow the rhythm, but also to delve deeper, because we have generations upon generations. So when we touch the floor, it is as if we were knocking on the door of a generation, of our ancestors, of one of our ancestors.

So, the deeper you hit the floor, the further back you go to your ancestors. And when they wake up, they’ll send energy back to you. That’s why, the deeper you reach into the floor, the more powerfully your ancestors will respond. It’s also something that’s really inside us, connected to our breathing. So when you breathe, as if with the intention of reaching deep into the ground, what comes next is no longer your voice; it’s something else. It’s your body responding with this energy.

It’s energy that’s coming out. That’s why, in our practice, there’s an exercise I call, “the champagne bottle”. We have to imagine the body just as it is, as something solid. And then we have to imagine a liquid inside our body, a liquid that contains gas. The more you shake it, the more activity is generated within the liquid. So this is what we have to do: imagine our body like this. We have to shake the bottle from all our extremities. If we shake it, the more you shake it, the more energy and force the bottle will have to explode.

In this way, the body becomes a conduit through which energy flows downwards; it rises from below, passes through your body and is projected towards the audience, across the space, towards the other, towards the voice. In this way, the body becomes a channel and this energy is also transformed into a cycle of communication with the layers and the space.
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APROPOS are contents created specifically about something happening in our artistic context. On this occasion, in collaboration with Mercat de les Flors, we present this interview on the occasion of the presentation of Vagabundus.